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Post by Two Tales on Apr 12, 2005 16:34:04 GMT 12.75
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Post by Paws on Apr 13, 2005 2:13:45 GMT 12.75
If that happens again see if you get a warningor error message that you can remember for me TT. We'll wait until you get your bread dough run down printed. ;D
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Post by Two Tales on Apr 15, 2005 18:25:56 GMT 12.75
Ok I'll do this in shorter batches...the staff of life...
Breads...raised and quick breads...although most of us think of bread as that crusty brown loaf you get down at the bakery or from your local market many of us have been making them for years without even realising it..what do I mean by that??..ok lets start with the raised breads those are the loaves, nice an brown sliced neatly, or the dinner rolls served at Thanksgiving or whenever..they use, for the most part, yeast to levin them... while quick breads are also levined, they use a chemical compound to cause the action like baking powder or baking soda...what are these....anything from biscuts to pancakes to grandma's banana nut bread to that lovely double chocolate devl's food fudge cake that Mrs Smith used to bring to the Church picknics..heck even muffins and cookies seem to fall in there...now really how many of you really ever thought of pancakes as bread ;D...except of course you folks that have to do that exchange thing...
both yeast and the chemical compounds do the same thing they create a gas that causes the breads to rise...yeast being a living biologic thing (actually a fungi) likes warm (not hot) moist enviornments with a good food supply....kind of like the rest of thier kin..and what better than bread dough...all it needs are those things to make it grow and produce the gas as a by product..
well the compounds work on basically the same principal but containe all the stuff they need to make thier gas..all that has to be done is to add water and heat...it doesn't need to set and grow..mix it up pop it in the oven
More to follow in a day or so....
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Post by Paws on Apr 16, 2005 3:43:21 GMT 12.75
You mean I got bugs belching and farting in my bread dough?? We also have boiled breads. We call them dumplings, noodles, spetzel, and pasta. And what about those breads we boil in grease?? Remember donuts?? ;D Questions?? Where does the leavin come from for sour dough? Is yeast a fungi, microbe, bacteria, or chemical reagent?
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Post by Mars on Apr 16, 2005 5:17:11 GMT 12.75
Yeast? I always thought it was a fungus that caused a "chemical reaction" in dough. I do forget if it creates oxygen or carbon dioxide to make the dough rise. Baking soda does pretty much the same thing though doesn't it?
Interesting family side note. My brother in-law is a Boyd. The Boyds that made the canning jars prior to Ball. He has all kinds of canning gadgets that he inherited over the years but like me never canned a thing. I always thought it strange that being a part of the family that was the tops in canning at one time and he never canned anything. Go figure.
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Post by Paws on Apr 16, 2005 7:33:24 GMT 12.75
Well, sort of! Yeast is a fungi that creates the leavin through fermentation of the sugars and carbohydrates found in the medium (fouur, sugar,milk, etc). Baking powder releases carbon dioxide gas through chemicaL REACTION. iN EITHER CASE THE GASSES FORMED ARE TRAPPED IN THE SPONGY STRUCTURE OF THE BREAD AND LIKE A BALOON FORCE IT TO EXPAND AS MORE AND MORE GQAS LIS SUPPLIED AND AS THE GAS NATURALLY LIGHTER THAN AIR TRIES TO RISE. I'm not shouting, I hit my caps lock and I ain't fixing it cause I still need to do taxes!! See: www.lesaffreyeastcorp.com/nutritional/manufacturing/faq.htmlYou guys know what?? This series of threads is getting really cool and I really appreciate all your efforts!! ;D Now, would one of you like to volunteer to moderate this category??
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Post by Two Tales on Apr 16, 2005 17:34:32 GMT 12.75
Paws after I posted I saw a portion of "Paula's Kitchen" see made up a batch of "Uncle Bubba's Beer Biscuts" using the beer as a levining agent...Course she used a "mix" as the medimum..already had every thing but the liquid and baking powder...puffed up real nice and flakey in the muffin pan... So just what is bread...how is "it" defined?.... is it any thing made from a grain that is not eaten as a soup grull (thickener) or cerial??? or do we class it up some other way...such as molded, formed or manipulated into a shape??? I'll have to pass on the monitor thing paws as I have enough trouble keeping my own up and going ;D ;D ;D
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Post by Paws on Apr 17, 2005 0:20:57 GMT 12.75
Thanks TT for the input and consideration! ;D However as slow as this board is getting we may not need a Moderator; or even the board much longer!! Paula just irks me!! I can't put my finger on it, but I have a real hard time taking her stuff seriously and she has some good stuff.
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Post by Two Tales on Apr 21, 2005 11:50:12 GMT 12.75
Paws,
I know what you mean about Paula, I think it's because there is no explaination...nor is there ryhme or reason to her style...
Now back to breads ;D...why do we "kneed" raised breads...and when should we stop...how is it done...is there really a right and wrong way...we kneed to remove extra gas from the dough...this should be done gently and with a folding motion using the heel of your hands..you should stop once the dough reaches a state that it appears a bit shinny and has good elastisity {sp}...at this point the glutins in the flour have streched forming strands and will be able to encapsulate the remaining gases produced as a byproduct of the yeast...this is done after the first rise, which allows the volume of the dough to roughly double...belive me when I tell you, you don't even want to not kneed it at this point ;D ;D...this has been refered to as "punching down" the dough....the method I suggested is by far better...if you actually were to punch on the dough it would seperate the strands in the glutin and your bread would not be nearly as nice in texture nor taste..at this point it can be shaped into loaves and allowed to rise again not for as long though (about 20min), or before the first rise you can spread out and covered with all sorts of goodies from apples to zucinni...rolled up and cut slices like cinnimon rolls or bake whole after letting it rise for about 45 min...
Well enough for today see ya'll later ;D
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Post by Paws on Apr 21, 2005 13:14:34 GMT 12.75
Pretty good coverage there of "Yeast Breads" TT! Thanks much. Punching down the dough is just a single blow to the dough in the bowl. Then it is shaped into loaves, possibly cut for rolls and allowed to rise again. The first rise isn't really a rise; but, more of a rest following development of the gluten strands and "gas pockets" during kneading. Of course the first rise does further stretch the fibers and develop even greater elasticity. The second rise is the important one because this will give you the final texture of the product. Nicely done there TT! Want to do quick breads now??
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Post by CHUCK1 on Apr 21, 2005 16:32:15 GMT 12.75
Question #1 I remember watching mom ,grandmothers ,and mother inlaw shape loves and buns and sort of smack them they said it was to get the air out between risings is this normal practice ? #2 How would one calculate portion size and carbs for these breads. MY wife makes a fried bread with flower, sugar ,baking powder and water it's quick easy and i'd like to know how to calculate this if anyone could help.
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Post by Two Tales on Apr 22, 2005 1:04:30 GMT 12.75
I'm not exactly sure how to estemate portions but I would guess (correct me if I'm wrong Paws) that it depends on the total nutritional value of the product...from there you would need to know how much of what the people or person would need based on thier particular needs...sense the new food pyramid but here are some numbers for the fry bread you ask about... Flour amount cal carbs fiber protien Wheat 1 cup 400 87 3.4 11 Rye 1 cup 400 83 9.0 12 whole Gr 1 cup 400 80 8.0 15 sugar 1 tsp 15 4 0 0 1 cup 744 199.8 0 0 Plus what ever fat used to fry them in should be figured in... see this site: www.lowfatlifestyle.com/foodstats.htmWhen Grandma used to slap the dough, she was "punching it down" many folks still do this...however as said before folding and pressing the dough with the heel of the hand makes for a better texture IMO Now don't get me wrong the way she did it was not wrong..and in many cases there was a schedule to keep so kneeding the dough had to be done as quickly as possible so "punching down" was necessary.... I'm not sure how the table above is going to come out so just take a line at a time...
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Post by Paws on Apr 22, 2005 3:50:54 GMT 12.75
Portion sizes are pretty easy to calculate. For commercial products thet are marked on the container. The diabetic food pyramid shows portion sizes for each grouping of food with variance for prepared and raw foods. Bread is one serving or one slice, goocked grains are usually 1/4 cup, pasta usually 1/4 cup raw or 1/2 cup cooked, vegetables (other than potatos, sweet potatoes, corn, beets, and other "starches" is gesnerally 1/2 cup raw or 1/4 cup prepared. Juices are 1/4 cup, meats and cheeses are 1 ounce so a standard four ounce serving would be considered 4 servings of meat plus fats associated. It isn't that difficult to get a handle on it. These "serving sizes" can be determined to be any unit you choose for the bread just do the math for the nutrient content. Somebody please double check this for me and if I have made any errors please advise.
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Post by Two Tales on Apr 22, 2005 7:39:18 GMT 12.75
huh? ? ?
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Post by Paws on Apr 22, 2005 13:21:11 GMT 12.75
Where did the Quick Breads go??? I was reading them, I thought; then Whamo!!
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Post by Paws on Apr 22, 2005 13:28:02 GMT 12.75
Take the total nutrient content for the dish and divide it by the number of servings. This will give you the measurement of nutrients per serving. Next convert this figure to an "exchange" value. In the case of an exchange value for starches, carbohydrates, grains, or breads, 1 serving of carbohydrates is equal to about 20 grams of carbohydrates; therefore a serving of bread containing 40 grams of carbohydrate would be equal to two servings of carbohydrates or 2 servings for the cereal. grain, bread, starch, carbohydrate, etc food group.
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Post by CHUCK1 on Apr 22, 2005 13:28:15 GMT 12.75
Thanks guys kind of what i had in mind.
I've got some old cook books stashed i'll post as soon as I find them
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Post by Two Tales on Apr 22, 2005 15:00:16 GMT 12.75
Paws, what happened? ? man I did that on line too...dag nabbit... something ate my quiick bread thread....
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Post by Paws on Apr 23, 2005 1:42:19 GMT 12.75
I'll say one thing TT; "That bread was quick! Essentially what TT said was that quick breads, including muffins, coffee cakes, rolls, corn bread and the like gettheir leavining from c chemical reaction using baking powder, baking soda, or cream of tarter. Did you know that cream of tarter is added to baking powder and then called "Dosuble Acting" baking powder. Yep. Gasses formed when liquids are added or when heat is applied cause the batter to rise during their attempt to escape leaving the dough light and airy when finished. These kinds of breads are referred to as Quick Breads because there is no need to wait and let them rise. OK then what about Sour Dough!! Combining flour, sugar, and water to make a very thin dough and then allowing it sit in a warm spot in the house creates what is called the "Mother" or "Starter". This starter accumulates yeast microorganisms directly from the environment that feed on the fermenting sugars and reproduce or grow additional yeast cultures. After several days of incubation the starter may be divided and part of it used as a leavening agent in bread recipes. And altogether; that is pretty much how breads are caused to rise! That is baked breads anyway. Remember that baking is the uniform application of heat in a dry environment. This includes pancakes or hotcakes on top of the griddle; they just bake "one side at a time!" ;D Now TT if I can get you to do some "boiled breads".... I will start working on eggs. After that is finished we can pick one of the cooking techniques and start doing it along with some recipes.
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Post by Paws on Apr 23, 2005 1:43:53 GMT 12.75
Be looking forward to those recipes Chuck1!!
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